The Mightiest Warriors
The Mightiest Warriors is a podcast that shines light on the remarkable stories of humans who have transformed profound adversity in their lives into a force of compassion, leadership and service to others.
"He who has a why to live for can deal with almost any how."
Victor Frankl
The Mightiest Warriors
The Legacy of Service: A Green Beret's Journey
Michael "Rod" Rodriguez's life reads like an epic American saga—a generational story of service spanning from his grandfathers to his son. As a Green Beret with ten combat deployments behind him, Rod now leads the Global War on Terrorism Memorial Foundation with the same fierce dedication that characterized his military career.
When Rod shares the origin of his different-colored eyes—keeping a prosthetic blue lens after a young girl with heterochromia saw herself reflected in him—you immediately understand his character. "The good Lord made you that way," he told the child who was bullied for her appearance. "I have to try to look as cool as you." This moment of connection reveals Rod's natural empathy and selflessness, traits that defined his military service.
The heart of Rod's philosophy comes from two simple words his father spoke before he enlisted: "Just do more." During the grueling Special Forces selection process, when pushed beyond what seemed possible, these words sustained him. Unlike "do your best," which creates a self-imposed ceiling, "do more" acknowledges our nearly limitless human potential. It's a philosophy that carried Rod through ten deployments and now drives his mission to create a memorial for America's longest war.
What makes the Global War on Terrorism distinct—and why this memorial matters so profoundly—becomes clear as Rod explains its unprecedented nature. This is a conflict where children who watched their parents deploy are now serving in the same war. It's a global struggle that has claimed not only over 7,000 military lives but also more than 3,400 non-uniformed Americans whose sacrifices often go unrecognized. By creating a space on the National Mall where these contributions are honored, Rod believes we impart value to those who have given so much.
Join us as Rod shares how service taught him that "devotion cannot exist without love," why ego is the enemy of growth, and how his current mission might be his most important yet. Subscribe to hear more conversations with extraordinary warriors whose stories remind us of the power of human resilience, community, and purpose.
Hi, I'm Dr Mark Pettis, the medical director of Essential Provisions, a whole food nutrition sports performance company that makes meals ready to eat and sports blends for the warriors of the world, and this is the Mightiest Warriors podcast, which is sponsored by Essential Provisions. And today I am just so pleased to bring to the world our first Mightiest Warrior interview, and I'm delighted to be here with Michael Rod Rodriguez. Rod Rodriguez and Michael, pardon me for working off a paper just to summarize your amazing life, but Rod is the president and CEO of the Global War on Terrorism Memorial Foundation. Rod has a, and his family, as we'll learn, has a rich intergenerational legacy of service to this country.
Speaker 1:Rod joined the US Army in 1992, attended the Special Forces Assessment and Selection Course and became a Green Beret in 1997. In 2013, he was medically retired due to numerous combat injuries and his last assignment as a Green Beret was as a sniper instructor assigned to the JFK Special Warfare Center at Fort Bragg in North Carolina. Rob has been deployed 10 times over the course of his service. His involvement with GWOT, the Memorial Foundation, began in 2016. And he has served in the CEO executive director role really for the last few years, since 2021.
Speaker 1:There is so much I could add, rod, as I know we'll get into, you've been a member of President George Bush's Military Service Initiative Advisory Council. You helped direct the Afghanistan withdrawal and your advocacy for our troops there and yours is such a fitting inspiration for stewardship and service. Rod know you, you also delve into uh, uh artwork and are very attuned to the importance of art and uh the healing of of uh military recruits and many have been traumatized and uh, hopefully we can get into that a little bit and on behalf of essential provisions, uh. Thank you, rod, for being here.
Speaker 2:No, I appreciate the opportunity to talk. You could have shortened all that Say hey, I got this old retired Army guy we're going to have a conversation and we could have you know. Could have saved you a few minutes, man, I appreciate it though.
Speaker 1:Really important that people appreciate the depth of your dedication and service. And so, off the top and totally unrelated, rod, so I'm a physician and right away, of course, I noticed your eye color, which you know. The medical term for that is heterochromia.
Speaker 2:Heterochromia.
Speaker 1:And you probably know this, but there's a very rich and interesting connection of heterochromia in the indigenous cultures you know the Native Americans looked at. Of course they didn't call it heterochromia, but they saw that attribute as a manifestation of deep spiritual wisdom and an ability to connect to that spirit world. And so just to kind of add that as an aside, I have no doubt of your ability to do that.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm not sure how much wisdom I have, but yeah, it's. You know I wear a special lens. It's a prosthetic lens that I wear and if we got time for a brief story on why it's this way, so my grandmother, my great grandmother, had one blue eye, right, she had. My great grandmother actually had heterochromia, my father's grandmother and you know, when I was getting fitted, you know, they were like, hey, this one will fit, but it doesn't match right. And I'm like, okay, that's fine, I'll take it. So it was blue.
Speaker 2:And shortly after that, this was 2014, because up until then, I was just wearing an eyepatch and I was traveling through an airport, going through security, getting ready to go through his DCA up in Reagan National in Washington DC, and I turned around there's a young little girl, about six, seven years old, eyes identical to mine, like a brown eye and a blue eye like mine, and she looked up at me and I was just like, oh my gosh, look at this, look at her, you know. And she grabbed her mom tugged on her on her shirt. She was mommy. She grabbed her mom tugged on her shirt. She goes mommy, mommy, that man has eyes like I do. And I said, no, sweetheart, your eyes are far more beautiful than mine. The good Lord made you that way. I said I have to try and look as cool as you. This isn't real. I have to wear a special lens to help me. She goes why. I said well, I was a soldier at one point. I got blown up are far more beautiful. So it was my.
Speaker 2:As I turned around, it was my turn to go to the TSA. Gentlemen, you know, check your ID and and ticket and once I get through security at the end this you know where you put your shoes on and such the mother comes over to me and she goes thank for that. I go for what I go. Man, that was awesome and you have a beautiful little girl. And she goes no, really, thank you for that. She says my daughter gets bullied relentlessly and because of her eyes, and I've never heard her say anything positive about her eyes. This is the first time she said she's proud to have eyes like a soldier and I was like holy crap, I'm getting choked up telling the story. So I guess that was 2014. And I don't remember the girl's name. I didn't stay in touch with them, but I was like you know what, screw it. So you know, the next day I called my doc. I'm like, hey, dude, let's just keep this color man. So that's why it's just my own little thing that I've decided to do.
Speaker 1:Thank you for sharing that. Yeah, the many traditions right see the eyes as the window to the soul, and so you recognize that clearly in that young girl who's probably never going to forget that brief encounter. The seemingly random, brief encounters take significance, often in a way that we don't fully appreciate. As time marches on. You grew up in New Mexico, I believe.
Speaker 2:Yes, I grew up in southern New Mexico. I was born in a very small town called Deming, New Mexico. It's very close to the border of Mexico. Right there, my family's from southern New Mexico and southern Texas. I was born in Deming but I was raised in Las Cruces, New Mexico.
Speaker 1:And I know there's a very rich legacy of service. Your grandfather's on both your mother and father's side served, of course, your father, your ex-wife and your son I've heard you talk about. Tell me a little bit about what it was like growing up in a family that had such a deep and rich service to our country. How did that impact you growing up?
Speaker 2:So I will say that my the first heroes in my life, my first year, was my father. I think that's the same for for for a lot of us. And you know my grandfathers and and my great uncles who served during world war II. You know that my, my, my grandmothers had the pictures of them in uniform on the wall and I would, you know, when they were kids, right Just out there doing what the nation asked them to do and sent them forward to do. So those are my heroes growing up and I would always ask them the oldest grandson on my on my father's, or grandchild on my father's side. And I asked a lot of questions Cause I played with a little green army man. You get like a Kmart and you know a little green tank and you know. So I'm sure some people are like where's Kmart? Yes, maybe some of your younger viewers were like what's Kmart? Right, but I'll be 51 here pretty soon. So anyway, I would ask questions.
Speaker 2:And they never wanted to talk about the war and any of us who have served and stepped into that arena and you know, participated, participate like, done some of the stuff or experienced or whatever. Whatever your interaction is, we, I don't talk about it. We don't glamor I don't glamorize war. Do I think it's necessary? Yeah, we. In order to maintain peace, you have to be capable of visiting violence on those that would do you harm. That's the reality. People can argue that all day. It doesn't make me a killer or a warmonger, just means I'm willing to serve. So my father and grandfather never glamorized the war. They never talked about it. But whenever I could get anything out of them, um, usually they just tell me to shut up. You know. You know they would just tell me to shut up, basically. But you know, when they did speak, they didn't speak about the war. They spoke about those to their left and right, those they served with.
Speaker 2:And the men in my family are very stoic, very reserved. They don't show a whole lot of emotion. I'm not saying they didn't love me and they didn't show me love, but I'm saying they're very, very reserved, traditional men. And when they spoke about these gentlemen that they served with, they spoke about them with reverence and love. That impacted me tremendously as a kid and I grew up about them with reverence and love. That impacted me tremendously as a kid and I grew up.
Speaker 2:You know my culture. You know, familias primero, families first. You know there's and, and so I was like man, who are these theos, these uncles that I've never, that I don't get a chance to meet, or that lost their life? And we have a cousin that that is on the Vietnam wall. He died in Vietnam, and so we listened to these stories and that inspired me to, you know, grow my family Like well, I want to experience this for myself because of how impactful it was to them, and them being my heroes. Of course, you try to emulate your heroes, and that inspired me to step into the arena.
Speaker 2:You know, as, as they did, and and as you stated, you know, uh, I'm blessed, like my best friend is is what I refer to? Kelly. Uh, you know my ex-wife now, I mean we. You know she's the mother of my three sons. Um, you know, she served for 21 years as well, deployed six times. It's just, you know, as, towards the end, it just we were, we as a relationship never had a relationship. It was always about the children or work. So we realized that later on and are no longer together. But, like I said, she's still my best friend.
Speaker 2:So then, of course, you know, our oldest son is currently serving here at Fort Bragg. I live in North Carolina. He's been in the army about eight years. He's serving at Bragg. My youngest son just graduated high school last year and looking at joining the military, but he wants to do it as an officer, as an RN, so we're pretty proud about that right. We finally have an officer in the military in our family, not just a bunch of us enlisted. So that's our family. But I joke around with it a lot. But apple trees make apples right, so that's just what my family does.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's beautiful Rod, and my father was a World War II vet and, as you described, very stoic. There wasn't a lot of conversation about the war, even when there was curiosity and, as you pointed out, he would often well, when he did talk about it, it was about his buddies, those he served with, and some he was still in touch with, of course, some he lost. Yeah, yeah, it was an interesting time, and your dad served in Vietnam, yeah, and that certainly was a really interesting time, just culturally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was, you know. And you know, when I said told, my father was 17 years old, I graduated from high school a little bit early, but when I told him I wanted to unless, was like, I'd rather you not. You know he served during the, the ted offensive, which was, you know, the bloodiest year. Uh, we had the most casualties during that, during that conflict. He didn't have the greatest experience, obviously, um, you know, that was when we lost our cousin as well. Um, so he was like miko, just, I'd rather you're not. I said dad, look, I, I have to do this. I just this is what I want to do. And he was like, okay, miko, go ahead. But then he gave me some advice that I didn't really understand.
Speaker 2:You know, 17 years old, I didn't understand until, like you know, uh, eight, nine years later, as he said, miko, look, um, just once you understand what you're getting into, you're going to be put in situations that you're not going to understand and that, no, nothing can prepare you for. You're going to be asked to do things that people think you probably can't do. Um, that you, you may even doubt yourself. He goes, all you have to do is just do more. He's me whatever's asked of you, just do more. And I was like, okay, I understand the wisdom behind that simple statement just do more, more. But then you know, it was uh years later, when I was in selection. Uh, you know, tryouts, try to become a special forces guy. Uh, you know, green beret?
Speaker 2:Um, I was, it was during a, uh, an individual event and I man it was it was sucking, I mean I was not doing good, right, I was just like, ah, and I started. Everybody says everyone gets those moments where they're like start feeling sorry for themselves. Right, and I did, and I, and then I heard my dad's voice hey, miko, just do more. I took another step, do more. I kept doing it, I kept doing it and then I really started reflecting and and my father never really said growing up, he never told us hey, do your best, do your best. I, we never heard that growing up.
Speaker 2:And then I, as I continue to ponder this, I'm out there like trying to breathe, right in selection, just keep going, right, just keep going. But I'm thinking about this and you really think about it if someone says do your best, what's your best, what is your best? No one knows their best. I've, I've been in situations where I pushed past my limits that I didn't even know existed, right, I mean I, you, just, you just keep doing. None of us, and you, as a medical professional, understand that no one really knows. So when you say do your best, that's a self-imposed finish line, that's a self-imposed cushy seat that we decide but no one else knows that and nobody knows that, because the human body, the human mind particularly, is far more capable than anything we could think of.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, it took a while for that seed to grow, but when it hit, it completely reframed. My approach on pretty much everything in my life is just hey, just do more. And I reflected and I don't compete with anybody. I understand my operational environment and I want to be sure I'm at least at par with those to my left and right. I would love to beat them, but I compete with me Every day. I do better than the guy I was yesterday, just to try to be a better version the next day. And all that came from those two words my dad said just do more.
Speaker 1:Well, I love that, rod. That is so profound. And you're right, yeah, do your best. Is I love what you said it's kind of a self-imposed bar? Is I love what you said it's kind of a self-imposed bar? It's not until you think you're at the very end of your rope that we have this potential to find a way.
Speaker 1:I've been struck in my work as a healthcare professional and I'm a kidney specialist by training and so many people through the years that I've interacted with these seemingly random events. I get called to see someone who's in our emergency department and they're confronting their mortality and often you know they would go through these incredible challenges and sometimes a great deal of suffering. And I was always struck at the seemingly endless capacity for the human spirit to rise above the most profound circumstances. I think it was the Holocaust survivor, viktor Frankl, who said he or she who has a why to live for can deal with almost any how. And I've learned a lot and most of what I've learned through the years have been from others, other human beings, and it's pretty incredible. And it's pretty incredible.
Speaker 1:Tell me a little bit about that journey of becoming a Green Beret, rod. I'm sure there are many people that they've heard of Green Berets. They're familiar with that. That's kind of a I hate to use the word an exclusive sort of tribe, but this is not something that just anyone could do, right? So tell me about that. What was that like?
Speaker 2:Yeah, sure, and I think exclusivity calling it an inclusive tribe is because there are standards and we hold each other to those standards, you know. So, you know, trying to jump into that just to do more right, you know I was inspired as a kid. I always wanted, you know, I did my research. I was like a little nerdy kid that wanted to learn all I could about the military. You know, at this point, you know, rambo had come out. I, you know, I had seen the Green Berets. The only Navy SEAL movie at that point was Navy SEALs with Charlie Sheen, and I thought that was awesome too, right, um, and? But I did my research and looked at all the services and thought about what would, what would I? I like to do more. And I just joined the army initially because that's that was my goal, that was always my goal. Uh, to, to do that, to, to just do more. Right, I wanted to try myself out, right, I could do that. And, um, in getting there, obviously selection is uh.
Speaker 2:We have a saying especially like selection is never ending. Well, that means, yes, you have that 24-day selection where they just beat you I mean, I'm not really beating you, but like man, it's, it's uh, there's individual events and there's team events. You're allowed to sleep like four hours a night, uh, max. And it's just no information is given. It's just it's. And you are judged as an individual Then how you operate, to see if you can handle the circumstances of problem solving skills. They assess. There's leadership skills that they assess that you don't know. And they don't yell at you. They're like all right, here's the standard, or not the standard? Like all right, here's an example, or not the standard. Like all right, here's a good example, all right, be here at this time. You look at the whiteboard and it says be here Wearing this with this equipment in your pack minimum weight whatever and in this uniform, and you show up.
Speaker 2:You have no idea what you're going to do and then they tell you okay, the briefing for this individual event, for example, would be okay, here's some cones. Okay, here's some cones. They're on these unimproved roads. Follow the cones, move as quickly as you can, do your best, go. You have no idea. Are you running three miles? Is this 24 miles? You just go and you're there with your peers and, like I said, I compete myself, but I don't want to be the guy in the back. You don't ever want to be last, so you just go. So there's like one example. I don't say it's a mind game, but it tests and assesses your mental fortitude, like, okay, how much do I go, what do I do, how do I go? And it was actually during one of those events when I was just I was going as hard as I could go because I didn't know how far I was. And that's when I my dad's voice popped up in my head hey, just do more, just do more.
Speaker 2:So I wanted to do that become a special forces Green Beret. Because, um, you know, we, of all the special operations forces, you know there's an intense rivalry but there's a lot of crossover. I mean, if you talk to any of my, my brothers in arms, my comrades, you know whether it's a MARSOC Raider, or even the Force Recon guys from way back in the day, or my Frogman brothers in the Navy SEALs, or you know, our Air Force Special Tactics guys, which I don't think get talked about enough, but we have there's very small community, but them cats. Or even within the Army, we have, you know, our Ranger Ranger Battalion. I mean, we're the same type of people we really are. So you think about it like, think about professional athletes, and then there's different leagues, right, and that's really what it is. So that's why I say it's an exclusive group and it is never ending, because after for us the selection is 24 days.
Speaker 2:And then for me I was an 18 Delta. I was a medic. My Q course, qualification course, was two years long because it was. I was trained in everything from veterinary medicine to dentistry, to doing labs, to surgeries, to I mean, you name it if it had something to do with medical preventive medicine, I mean everything. So it was a really academically challenging. So you know you do that. Then you get to a team and, yeah, each of us have a specialty, but you're one team. You're a special forces operator first, so you will do direct action or unconventional warfare, or foreign internal defense, teaching other nations how to defend and fight for themselves. So we don't have to send our you know men and women to fight for them.
Speaker 2:Counter-terrorism. There's, there's so many things that we do as far as skill sets that I think Special Forces Green Berets have the broadest mission. You know, to help people understand a little bit, an analogy I use is if you look at law enforcement, the Department of Justice. You know you have the FBI, the DEA, the ATF. You know the US Marshal's Office. You can look at those and be like, all right, yeah, I know what the ATF is involved alcohol, tobacco, firearms. I know what you know the others do, but what does the FBI do? Well, you do all of that too, but then they do this right. So it's a very broad skill set and mission set and also we're taught foreign languages and I really wanted to, you know, expand my horizons and work in with people of different nations, different languages, different belief systems, to try to improve my own communication. But to, you know, learn how to be a better human. You'll always have an opportunity to learn that from everybody have opportunity to learn that from everybody.
Speaker 1:Wow, yeah, that's. It would be hard for anyone who's never experienced something like that to appreciate just how demanding at every level, and so would it. Would it be fair to say you know, I love just what you started with about your father's voice. Do more, I would think, and again I can only use my own life experience, rod, where many times I thought I was at a place where I simply could not move further. And then somehow you find a way. I learned a lot about myself as I continue to develop and mature and have these experiences. You must have learned a lot about yourself along the way there, even when you think you go in knowing who you are right. I mean, what were some of the things about yourself that maybe you would have never imagined possible had you not had those experiences?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you know my problem solving skills. You know, growing up, where I grew up, you know, if you never leave your hometown, that's fine. But you think like everybody else around you, right, you're involved with your surroundings and you work. You know, like that saying like you are who you hang out with, right, you are who you, and that's absolutely true. So when it comes to that's why I say problem solving skills is, I think you know, in a different life I probably would have been an engineer or you know, or something like that.
Speaker 2:Like figure, I love math, I love to figure things out. How do you get this figure this out? Like, okay, this, this, this, you know so anyway. But for me, the best way I could explain it is if I go and learn how other people think, what other people believe, then it challenges my own way of thinking. It even challenged my own. You know thought processes, I know how to solve this. But if I see how someone else has solved it in a different way, huh, well, maybe their way is better or maybe I can use what they did to make mine more efficient, and that's I'm just using like a solving a problem as an analogy.
Speaker 2:But if you look at everyday life, that's what you do. You wake up every day okay, I have things I got to get done. There are certain things that have to happen. Some things may not Okay.
Speaker 2:What are those are problem solving skills, and you know me experiencing it in various parts of the world with various different people and operating at a level that with my peers, you know, the, the, the, the hombres to my left and right were, you know, man, some of the smartest, quick witted, sometimes mean, meanest guys, that tough love thing.
Speaker 2:But I mean they push you because they're. They push you because that tough love is, because they want you to be better, because we have a responsibility to each other. So that environment it's incredibly, I guess, aggressive you could say that or it's very shark tank, right, like, like you got to perform. That's why selection is never ending, because I know in special forces in our community, if you're not meeting the standards and you're just not the guy or something significant happens that is completely contrary to who we are in special forces, I think of the special operations were the only one like this where, okay, because everyone had a job, an MOS, right, whether you're an infantry guy or a communications guy before you became a special forces operator, what we do is okay, well, you're not what we're looking for, and they take your special forces tab and your Green Beret because it's an award, and okay, go back and do. Maybe you're just a better light-wheeled mechanic than you thought you could be as Green Beret.
Speaker 2:So, it's never ending. I saw that occur with senior guys throughout my career, so that standard is always there. So you're always pushing yourself to to perform. And what I learned about myself is if I'm in an environment where we are pushing each other, then I'm encouraged, right. I love to be around those that will just keep pushing you and sometimes I joke around by being mean but like, just push me, just like, okay, just challenge me, cause I love a challenge. I've always loved the challenge.
Speaker 2:I love someone when they tell me you can't do that or say, no, it's like all right, well, I can't do that, or you don't think that. Or say no, it's like all right, well, I can't do that, or you don't think I can do that. Those are two things. So in that environment it really pushed me to be a better and learn that if I didn't, I don't know if I'd be the guy I am today, because I have three younger brothers that are still in New Mexico and I'm not throwing shade at my brothers. I love them, they're great, they're great men. But we approach life so differently, we look at things so differently, but we were raised in the same house with the same set of values, in the same environment and I look at them and I'm like I want to be proud and content with the person I am, but they are so different I mean incredibly different, with everything that they do. That's what I would be and I'm happy. I am who I am. I don't know if any of that made sense.
Speaker 1:Yes, thank you, it made total sense. I've been struck just in listening to you on the internet YouTube, some of the things where I've heard you just talking about um uh, the work that you do, rod uh, there there is very little ego that that comes across. Uh and um uh, you know I. I wonder you know, when you're in a team such a a sophisticated, highly skilled team, uh, as you are with the Green Beret, your brothers and sisters serving with you, I would imagine that on some level you have to kind of leave your ego at the door. Right, there's an intense sort of interpersonal. You become a shared brain in many respects. Everyone has to be in synchronicity. How, I mean, is that accurate when I'm thinking?
Speaker 2:It is, it absolutely is. I'll give you an example.
Speaker 1:But on some level it's always about the team right. It's always about the big picture, the others contributing being part of something much greater. Is that a fair?
Speaker 2:It, it is, and and to talk, to touch on on your ego, comment uh, that's absolutely what it is. So when I went, before I went to, to become a special forces guy, um, um, I mean there wasn't anyone in my unit that was faster. I mean someone, some people probably made him a smarter, but I mean that was always like first right. So you know, if you're in a certain league with people and nothing against them, right, it's just all right. It's just we're all different. We're all born with the level of intelligence We'll always have. We just have different functional capacities and different genetics. I mean, it's just who we are. The good Lord bless you with the genes you have. What are you going to do with them? It's easy to get complacent, but if you're in an environment where there's always someone smarter, stronger, faster, better at shooting, better at assessing something or better at sending a SATCOM blast, if you're in an environment where people are pushing you like holy crap, like I said, you don't ever want to be last. You don't want to be that guy, because I have a responsibility to them. For the same reason, your father talked about those you served with my father, and grandfather and uncles talked about those they served with. The reason they talk about them is because they had a responsibility to them. None of us that deployed or did anything that we do or have done or will do wrote the foreign policy that sent you forward, made the decision. Those happened in dc. We, we don't do that, we're just okay. We do it when you get there. Really, if you ask them, are you here because of this foreign policy? No, no, they're there because they committed to our nation to serve us in whatever capacity than our elected leaders deemed necessary. That's it. That's why you're there. And when you get down there, and in those moments it's those to your left and right, right, there was an. That's why, you know, some people can't fathom the level of heroism that particularly our medal of honor recipients, um, you know, have exhibited. And when you think about it, that's love man, they're just doing that. They weren't doing it for foreign policy, they weren't doing it. They were doing it because of those to their left and right and that's what it boils down to.
Speaker 2:So you know the ego piece, at least for me. I'm not going to say we don't have any ego guys or gals out there. There are, you know, you can, there's, there's, you know, plenty of them have podcasts and they're easy to find, right, there's a lot of ego out there, but I choose not to be, because I have found that the loudest person in the room, uh, is probably the weakest. The loudest, the person talking the most, is probably the most insecure. The individual that's claiming the most is probably the biggest liar.
Speaker 2:So I, when I showed up to my special forces attachment on day one, I, I've always been an athlete. I, I, I make sure that I'm in incredibly good shape, or as good shape as I could possibly be. I know I'm not an idiot, but I just shut up and listen and I don't bring any ego with me anywhere, because I don't. Why would I? If you bring ego into a relationship, a conversation, any situation, any social interaction, or even if you're on your own and you're trying to do something, your ego gets in the way. It's going to impede any progress that could potentially come out of that engagement or interaction. So I don't, I try to leave the ego at the door, right? I know what I bring to the table. I know what's in my pockets. I know my experience. You know I choose to be that, that warrior in the garden that everyone thinks is a gardener.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's. You really have to know who you are to manifest in in that way. There are two things I've heard you say in other conversations, rod, that jumped out at me. You sort of alluded to this. One was with respect to service, that it was about the people, not the policy, which you know you just reiterated. The other is this you know I'm paraphrasing, but you said something to the effect that devotion does not exist without love. Love is the core. Devotion emerges from that, devotion to country, devotion to family, familia, devotion to your brothers and sisters in service, and that really touched me. That that was.
Speaker 2:that's pretty profound, and and and it's it's true if anyone thinks about it. You know, I think today, particularly in certain communities, the word love isn't used enough. I know I'll say my community, we're like oh, we don't say that, like, no, I, I grew up in a home where my father, like I referenced, you know he didn't show emotion, but my dad told me he loved me every day, so did my grandfather, so did I mean. So we said it and I can see that that was the basis for me. Like where, where did, where did this guy start Talk? Why did he start talking about love?
Speaker 2:Well, that's the way I was raised, and that you can't devote yourself something. And devotion, you know some people may think it's a, it's a relative term, but I don't think it is. You devote, if a devotion is okay, whatever I've committed to, whoever I've committed to, whatever that is like, every part of me is devoted, committed towards that, whether it's the mission, whether it's, you know, those that I'm serving with are, you know, the most important thing for me today is my children and my grandchildren. Right, that's my primary devotion. But you can't have that without love, you know. So you have to admit it, we have to say it. I don't think people use that word enough love, because if you don't talk about it then you're kind of diminishing the opportunities that it will present.
Speaker 1:And it's kind of an in-your-face striking paradox in a healing profession where you're really looking to develop relationship capital, and I love that connection between love and devotion.
Speaker 1:You've had 10 tours, I believe I have that right and uh, um, the and I and I want to get into obviously the, the global war on terrorism memorial foundation, that that you now lead Um, but you know, I I think it it might be. It might be challenging for some people to appreciate that the war on terrorism, I mean war is war, but the war on terrorism feels there's a different sort of playing field, playbook, context. You know, I think you know we can look back historically at World War I, world War II. There were this sort of defined beginning, there was an ending. You know, you learn about the players and the people and the politic, the in the politic um, the war on terrorism feels um a little bit different in that the, the enemy, takes the form of of different sort of countries, people, context, politics. What is I mean is that, is there truth to that? How you distinguish terrorism, say, to other wars that have sort of defined the history of our country.
Speaker 2:Right. So I think you know one of the one of the things where people have a have a challenge understanding what it is is I want you to think about, just for a second, those that have fought in it. Right, if you look at the numbers, world War Two, 11 percent of our nation fought, have fought in it. Right, if you look at the numbers. So world war ii 11 of our nation fought. Korea was seven percent. Vietnam, 4.3 percent of. Of those veterans, those, those combat veterans out there, you're talking about one percent of our nation, so that's a very small percent.
Speaker 2:Now, I think that's great. I'm not looking at that as a, uh, like a negative thing. I think it's. It's a beautiful statement, uh, that not everyone has to do what my family has chosen to do. Um, but because of that, there's a level of ignorance, right, there's a term that's tossed around quite frequently a civilian military divide. There is not a divide, there's just a misunderstanding. You know, when my father experienced coming home from vietnam, that was a divide, no question about it, and because of his generation, that will that will never occur again, right, and it was shameful how that veteran, how that population, was treated Because, again, to remind everybody.
Speaker 2:We are not involved in the policy or decisions to send us forward. It's not, it doesn't happen like that. So when, unfortunately, when people have, and when you say war there should, it should evoke emotion. It should like it's a profound statement. But don't direct that at those that are doing it for you, selflessly. Right, they're not doing it for self-aggrandizement. You don't know who they are. They're not, damn sure I ain't doing it for money, right? They? You know they make less than teachers. So it's good, it's important to separate the people from the policy and politics. So now pivot to the war on terrorism. So the fact that there's a tremendous level of ignorance that exists, there's even an ignorance that exists within our community, the veteran community.
Speaker 2:So nobody considers Operation Overlord, which is the named operation of the D-Day invasion, its own separate war. And because, right now people think, well, we had two wars, afghanistan and Iraq, well, did we? And because right now, people think, well, we had two wars, afghanistan and Iraq, well, did we? Did you really, do you understand how this nation sends our sons and daughters, mothers and fathers, off to fight? It's done by operations, right? So at what point do we consider Operation Enduring Freedom its own separate war or Operation Iraqi Freedom, inherent Resolve, new Dawn, et cetera any other named operation I can name for you that have been conducted and authorized under the auspices of the Authorization of Use of Military Force.
Speaker 2:The AUMF signed September 18, 2001,. That empowered the President of the United States to fight terrorism globally. Now I won't get into the discussion on whether we need that or not. I personally think we do, because it's great to find people that are trying to, you know, conduct another 9-11 and prevent that. There are people, whether anyone wants to think about it that way or not, that would love nothing more than to come to your house and visit, harm onto you. That's the truth. I've come face to face with many of them. But that aside, you know people don't understand that, even in the veteran community. So the AUMF is still in effect.
Speaker 2:The Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, the Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary Medal, are still being awarded to service members that meet the criteria for the awarding of those medals. And here's something else the Global War on Terrorism, those two medals I just mentioned. You know my father has Vietnam Medal, korea Medal, world War II. I mean, it's what we do, it's how again, how we fight wars and recognize those that serve in it. Those medals have been awarded in Africa, south America, caribbean, pacific and the Middle East. So this really is a global war. So when people think about it they're like, well, it's hard to understand because it's incredibly complex and the world is a different place than it was, heck, five years ago. But when you think about we've been at this war, for we're coming up on our 24th year it's very hard for people to understand. So I would challenge anyone to listen to what I've just shared and then get smart on it.
Speaker 2:Read about it Right it's. There is no bookends. Will this war ever end? Probably not. There. There's a reality.
Speaker 2:You know, my both of my grandsons were born here at Womack Army Medical Center at Fort Bragg and I, as I was holding them, I'm like man. You know, I'm standing in a room of our family. All of us are veterans in this war and at some point, if these two, my two grandsons, decide to, you know, join the family business, they could be serving in the same war. And it's it's really unique, because never have we existed as a nation where sons and daughters watch their mothers and fathers go off to fight in a war, only to serve in that same war. My oldest son has been in the army eight years and deployed four times, was four years old when the towers fell on september 11th, which which then officially started this war. What would have been like for my dad to watch me graduate airborne school and go fight the Viet Cong, or my grandpa, to finish it, you know, to watch my father complete his training and go fight Nazis or serve in the Pacific.
Speaker 2:So when I say it like that, it's very people like oh my gosh, that's crazy. Well, yeah, that is crazy, but that's the reality of so few families. I mean, there's, there's a lot of us, but but such a small percent of our population. So that lends credence to the, the, the level of ignorance, and there's nothing wrong with being ignorant. I there's a lot of things I don't know. Definitely ignorance is, I just don't know. But that's why the mission that you know I've been working on for darn near a decade is so important. Because in the city that makes those decisions and sends our sons and daughters off to fight in this incredibly complex, misunderstood war, there's no reminder, there's nowhere for us to go, there's nowhere for us to gather in the city that makes those decisions. So the building of this national memorial is more important than people probably will ever understand.
Speaker 2:When I started working on this, ever understand the people. When I started working on this project, the people that pushed back the most were like ah, why that's? Why are you doing that? We don't need that. No, we don't. And I'm like was actual veteran community and their families, and I was like what do you mean? You know? And and then, and then it hit me, I'm like wait a minute, I'm not want. I don't want to build this memorial for me.
Speaker 2:I want want to build it for them, because, remember what I said about military service why do they serve? Why do they fight? Why are they doing what they do on the ground, placing themselves in harm's way for those? It's because of those, the love they have to those that are left and the right. So, if they feel they don't need it, what I started as telling them, I said okay, well, I want you to think about somebody that didn't come home, that you may know or heard of, or someone you know that is struggling right now because of some of the war that came home. Because the war does come home. Do they deserve it, and every single one of them like absolutely Hell, yeah, they deserve it. Okay, cool, I want you to think about them, I'll think about you, and when I say it like that, that reminds them of why they serve, what they're doing and the strength that they bring to the table.
Speaker 2:You know, and I have full belief and it's not just something, I, I really do believe that once we do this and I make this nation take a reverent knee and honor them and respect all those that have served in this incredibly complex, difficult to define war, those that have given so much, that struggle, so much, will feel a sense of value, like damn, thank you, like wow, like a real more than 10% off on Veterans Day at a Golden Corral, right, like when the nation does this, then we as a nation can impart value onto them. Because you know what, when someone feels value, you know what they're not going to do. They're not going to kill themselves. Of the 55 friends of mine that are no longer here because of this conflict, 10 lost the war at home, 45 were due to operations in theater. So the war does come home, and this mission to build this memorial could not be any more important than anything, because we don't honor the men and women and those families that step forward to serve and defend us all.
Speaker 2:To allow you and I, doc, to have this cool conversation who's going to do it in the future? Yeah Right, there's the burden. The burden is pretty heavy right now on a very, very small percent of our population. You just look at the recruiting numbers, right? I mean it's so to highlight us and not show us as broken, but to show the strength, resiliency, commitment and devotion that we have given to so many that have no idea who the hell we are. I think will inspire those to serve, because that's the strength of our nation.
Speaker 2:If you want to look at those that are serving, fighting and dying, have served and fought and died, they're the mirror image of everybody else. That's the strength of our nation. Is just your average everyday American coming together and say you know what? I think I have something to contribute, my dos centavos have value, right? And then they jump in and it's a beautiful thing. And that's how I look at this incredibly complex project that I've been working on for about two years, that I've had to pass two pieces of legislation to get to the house. I mean that's a whole 12 hour podcast if you want to get into bureaucratic steps and things that I had to do to get to this point. But the point is that's what I'm doing right now and I hope to cut the ribbon on this thing here in the next three, maybe four years.
Speaker 1:Okay, wow, what an incredible message and perspective. Yeah, I did wonder how steep the hill has been, as you awaken others to the importance of this and attract resources, and on some level, it would seem yeah, of course, it's a good thing to do, but for many of the things that you touched on, this is a different sort of socio-political context, and so it's not a quick A to B. Right, you've been on a significant uphill climb, opening eyes, speaking with passion, and it sounds like you're just from what you shared. You're, you're making progress, right, you feel there's a horizon where you can see this manifesting.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. You know, I guess I've been working on this for quite a period of time, but that is. You know we've we've done things and that people have told me were impossible to do. It really is like where this memorial we built is on the, on the national mall, on the reserve, and you know, the second bill that I that I passed was was that one to get an exemption so we could build it there. Otherwise it was going to be in between office buildings and the fabric of the city and no one would have really seen it or had the opportunity to learn more about these.
Speaker 2:This incredible, uh, two generations, two current generations of fighters and this that's why this memorial is so unique is we engage in two whole different generations of servicemen and women and their families that no other war memorial can do. That, um, and that's good. I'm not saying it's a bad thing. This is the longest conflict that we've ever been in, but that does not mean we shouldn't address it now, because if we don't, then when are we going to do it Right? So it's, it's incredibly important and you know it's, it's my current life's mission right now.
Speaker 1:So, outside of being a good father and grandfather, outside of being a good father and grandfather Beautiful, well, it gives me hope just hearing you translate that passion into something enduring and something that raises everyone's consciousness at a time where everyone's just so focused on their own lives getting through the day. You know all the hubbub out there. It can be hard to just be still enough long enough to bring one's awareness to just how huge and profound this is. And I've heard you say, rod, that and I think this too, at least in my experience, is not put in the spotlight. But there are a lot of non-military personnel right whose lives are lost, impacted, who are part of the infrastructure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah so terrorism, right, I mean it's bigger than those that have enlisted.
Speaker 2:Right, bigger. That's what those that have enlisted right. So this is about the people that have been mobilized and served and fought in whatever capacity, that it's not just us uniformed service members almost sheriff's stakeholders are, are are those that never came home right. But that's uniform and non-uniform. Our very first killed in action, the very first casualty we we experienced as a nation as a result of, of, of of the enemy, was a gentleman by the name of Johnny Michael Spann, killed November 25th 2001. Mike, as he went by, was a Marine in his previous career but was working for the CIA Special Activity Division and was part of the first boots on the ground. When those SF teams, those Green Beret teams, hit the ground, you know, with Team Alpha, they had some CIA cats with them right, and that was Mike, you know, a warfighter. And I've been on target many times. People dressed like me, looking like me, carrying the same equipment, same weapons, going in, hitting targets, doing what it is that we do. There are people that are in and out, going on target, doing what we do, that aren't in the military. Bullets and bombs are indiscriminate during time of war. I think everybody can agree to that.
Speaker 2:So it wasn't until 2019, the Department of Labor, who tracks that data, tried to figure out. Well, how many lives have we lost that weren't military or supporting theater operations? You know, in the global war on terrorism? Now we're over 7,000 uniformed service members. I will guarantee you know, probably nobody listening knows this, but there are over 3,400 non-uniformed. That's astounding, that's almost like. It's almost like shameful. We don't know that, we don't talk about them, but guess what? We have men and women performing a wartime mission in a hostile fire environment. That was once performed by one of us in uniform. That affords us the luxury to have such a small percent of Americans that serve today.
Speaker 2:So it's not just those military individuals that are out there putting their lives on the line. Whether they're a government official or a government worker, right, whether it's the FBI, cia, any of the other three-letter agencies, or whether they're some type of supporting the theater efforts as a contractor, it doesn't matter. They were out there doing a role where it was all was just the military. Look at world war two, right, like do you? You know that was all. How many civilians did they have serving at that point? I don't think very many. I'm sure there weren't. There were a few, but serving at that point? I don't think very many. I'm sure there were a few, but they weren't every single person worn the uniform, but we don't have to do that anymore.
Speaker 2:So that adds to the complexity and level of misunderstanding or ignorance that exists around this war. That has been going on and will probably continue for who knows, the foreseeable future. Right Terrorist organizations still pop up. There are people on this planet that want nothing to do than to shore your way of life I that's. It's pretty, pretty obvious. Anyone denies that got their head in the sand. Um, and that's not me. I'm not me being a hater, I'm just telling you I've. That's my entire military. My entire adult life has been a service to this nation in uniform, and now I'm trying to do it in a different way, by honoring. So I keep my finger on the pulse, I stay up on information, I'm involved as much as I'm allowed to with things that occur, but that's reality.
Speaker 2:So the beautiful thing about this memorial is I'm not selling snake oil, I'm not making anything. Everything I said, doc, you could say I didn't make it up, those'm not making anything, I'm anything, I. Everything I said, doc, you could say it's I didn't make it up. Those aren't my words. Yes, I use them. I pulled all this together to create, you know to, to craft it. You know the our, our messaging. But that's realities. Those are just basic realities and truths. And one thing we'll never deny is truth, and I want to tell the whole story on how we fought this war, because if we don't, then I'm not doing my job, I'm being ignorant and I'm being selfish. And now I'm making it about me, when it's got nothing to do with what I have done or my family has done. It's about the beautiful people of this nation, who I consider our greatest asset.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, that's just so apparent, rod, yeah, on behalf of all Americans, transparent, um, um, rod, yeah, on behalf of all americans. I'm just, you know, I get, I get the chills just listening to you. Um, it's, it's such an incredible um, I, you know it's, it's obvious that it's an incredible source of purpose and meaning and all that you do. Um, but before we bring this to closure, rod, and I'm so appreciative of your precious time and openness. It's really touching. This is going to touch a lot of people who listen to this. I notice in the background, rod, you've got a few framed letters and you're sharing what's behind you.
Speaker 2:Sure. So I referenced two pieces of legislation that we had to pass to get to where we are. So the first one was passed in 2017, and that granted us an exemption from a federal law that says a war has to be over for 10 years before a national war memorial can be built. A federal law that says a war has to be over for 10 years before a national war memorial can be built uh, wrong hand. So this one was signed by president trump in august of 2017.
Speaker 2:So then, after that, I went to work to pass the bill that everyone said was absolutely impossible, and that was to get this memorial built on the national mall. And, just for context, nothing new has been approved since 2003. They, in 2003, they said, hey, the National Mall is a finished work of art. No mas man, no more. And everybody's tried and no one's been able to do that, and that's through engagements with our stakeholders. Everyone goes it has to be there, rod. Like we got to do this. And I'm not a politics guy, I'm not a Capitol Hill guy. I got aspirations of running for any kind of office at any point in my life, so this isn't like, oh, here's another chance for me to go to Capitol Hill and get to make friends. No, that's not what this was. So then I went to work on that and it granting us the exemption for this memorial to be built within the reserve portion of the National Mall. So that's what's over my shoulders.
Speaker 2:This one right here, this flag over here was my retirement flag. You know, when you retire, you get a flag, and it's very special to me. And this flag right here and, uh, it's very special to me, and this flag right here, um and so, man, no one's ever asked me this um, a lot of times when we, when we would deploy, we have body armor on right and many of you know you have this big plate carrier and they have this big metal or not metal, but uh, um, ceramic, typically um, body armor right like the, the thing that stops the bullets, a lot of us would put flags in there, right, so we were always carrying a flag with us. Uh, this, this one here. I keep looking the wrong way. This one belonged to a friend of mine that is no longer with us.
Speaker 1:Wow, thank you. Thank you you for sharing that, rod, to establish a memorial and to bring the spotlight to the people, the stories, this chapter of who we are in America now and who we will likely continue to be as we protect our borders and protect our freedom. And I'm, I'm just so indebted, rod, to, to your service and I'm and I'm really just grateful to have met you. I I believe that nothing that happens in my life is a is a is a random coincidence. Nothing that happens in my life is a is a is a random coincidence. And uh, uh, you know to, to, to bring um, to cross paths with you and to share a little bit of your life force. Uh is um gives me hope, um, and I will never forget, uh, that that those two words, right, do more. And boy you are that your life is manifesting that to the fullest extent.
Speaker 2:Thank you Well yeah, I'm trying, I really am, you know, and you know, doc, I want to thank you for the opportunity to talk today and you know, I want to be sure that you know we all have a role to play right. Patriotism and service is not exclusive to those of us that raised our hands, recited the oath of enlistment, picked up a gun and ran to the sound of gunfire. Patriotism is is you know, and service is what I still do. I'm not in uniform, I've been on the army for a while but I still try. So I really hope that everyone understands it.
Speaker 2:Like, we all have an opportunity to define ourselves every single day. We all have an opportunity every single day, as my dad says, just to do more. And I don't base anything. I can't change the past, you know. You know that I can't forecast the future. I can plan for it, but I can't forecast it, you know. But what I can do is affect the now. So I think you know we all have opportunities to do things and I think it's our responsibility, to us as a nation right, to do that in some manner. So I want to thank you for what it is you do, doc, I appreciate it.
Speaker 1:My pleasure Now is where it's at, and you remind us of that, and so thank you for listening to the Mightiest Warriors podcast. Again to Michael Rod Rodriguez, our first guest. This is going to be a very hard act to follow.
Speaker 2:Oh no, I'm sure you're going to get some pretty awesome.
Speaker 1:Out of the gate. I thank you for that, Rod, and peace brother.
Speaker 2:Gracias.